Talk-It-Out Radio

The UNtraining

Racism is in the air we breathe, the water we swim in. We all are conditioned by it and it affects the interactions we have with one another. The UNtraining supports us in being aware of our conditioning and letting go of it. Host Marlena Willis talks with Robert Horton, cofounder of the UNtraining, and Kathleen Rice, an UNtraining teacher.

Robert Horton is co-founder and co-director of the UNtraining. He is a white man with a passionate interest in undoing racism and a belief that this process begins with oneself. Robert has been working with Rita Shimmin since 1994, studying her approach to multi-dimensionality which she calls Racism, Diversity and Risk of the Self. The UNtraining is based on their work together. Robert studied Process Work with Arnold Mindell and has practiced Tibetan Buddhism for more than 30 years.


Kathleen Rice initially joined the UNtraining in 2000, hoping to find the magic trick that she could use to get other white people to work to end racism and white supremacy. That’s not what she got. Instead, she has found something more sustainable, effective, and fulfilling — support for deeply feeling the pain of injustice as well as the joy of community. So instead of fueling her already developed skills of self-righteousness, guilt, shame and judgment, she has and continues to expand her capacity to better access the love, compassion, power, playfulness and joy she brings and receives in doing this work.

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